This was a much better podcast than Round #1. Thank you very much!
I saw one of your bulleted talking points was "advice for the younger generation" and I was hoping that you would address career choices for people just finishing high school. Sadly, you didn't have time.
I've got 2 neighbors with children who are graduating this year. One is a straight A student who has gotten several acceptance letters to colleges along with scholarships. She wants to study something in the medical field and would like to be an MD someday. When I asked her some of the details, the largest scholarships came from the more expensive schools. (Her folks are just getting by financially.) She would need to find other funding sources and flippantly said that she would just take out student loans. I suggested that she consider the local community college for the first 2 years of study. Her folks said that she could continue living with them. Her cost would be much less and wouldn't really impact her long term goals. It is an understatement to say that she wasn't thrilled with my advice. (I'm not too worried about her. She is smart and dedicated enough to make it work. I hate to see her saddled with debt.)
The neighbor boy is just glad to be done with school. He doesn't want to go to college. He just wants to work in a trade that will let him move out of the house and get on his own. He's got an aunt who can get him a job as a baggage handler at the airport. She didn't tell him what the hourly wage would be. I sat down with him and looked on their employment site and found a help wanted ad for an experienced baggage handler that was paying $12-$15 per hour based on experience. Then, we worked up a spreadsheet to include income and expected monthly expenses for living alone. It was an eye opener for him when he saw how little discretionary income was left.
He's good with his hands and practical. I can see him being a welder, electrician, plumber, carpenter, truck driver, etc. I can see problems with long term stability in each of these fields.
I've worked hard to build my community and watched these kids grow up for the last dozen years. In the next few years, there will be several more trying on these same shoes. This is their time when dreams and possibilities should be abundant. Yet, all I can see is the potential negativities. Rather than poke holes in their dreams, I'd prefer suggesting possible options that have a better chance of success. That's what I was hoping to hear.
Hi Grover,
When my step-son asked me what he should do I told him to be an airline pilot. Not because that is is what is a good job, but because it allowed him to dream big. It supplied the motivation to learn. He suprised me and got his commercial pilots licence. Not bad for a non-english speaking kid. (Russian).
He then matured enough to decide to become a dentist. By that time his basic education and study ethic was well established. He was so good that he won a free holiday to Russia from the dental school.
I worry about my second son as he is making a big bet on a technological future. He is going to get his doctorate in computing and mechatronics. (Think Robots) Common advice is not to go there but I am loath to pop his bubble. And besides which he would not pay me any attention.
The bright young girl's future is assured if she becomes a doctor.
"You should have the portfolio that allows you to sleep well at night, and that’s what my portfolio does for me, and I sleep like a baby."
Good advice. However, don't read Jesse's Cafe Americain just before going to bed. I wonder when I'll catch up on last night's lost sleep. Have you noticed the increasingly foreboding tone of his recent posts?
[quote=Grover]I've worked hard to build my community and watched these kids grow up for the last dozen years. In the next few years, there will be several more trying on these same shoes. This is their time when dreams and possibilities should be abundant. Yet, all I can see is the potential negativities. Rather than poke holes in their dreams, I'd prefer suggesting possible options that have a better chance of success. That's what I was hoping to hear.
Grover
[/quote]
Grover,
You are an amazing asset to your community. I sincerely hope the individuals getting your advice will appreciate it and thank you for it someday.
Nate
Grover, I just wanted you to know that you're not alone in these concerns, and I have no doubt Chris and Adam will address them in time. My kids are almost-15, 13, almost-11, and 9. The older one is already starting community college classes (as is not uncommon for homeschoolers) with a plan to get his first two years out of the way as inexpensively as possible, and only then consider going on to finishing a four-year degree if it makes career sense AND financial sense. I do not want my kids (or myself) taking out loans to fund their education. I might have to bend that a little for a relatively small loan, but I hope to hold that line.
My hope for my kids is that they will reach age 18 with some reliable means by which to make a living. I am very glad I thought to begin talking about this now (at the start of the "high school years" for my oldest) rather than at graduation age. I do not support college for my kids unless we have done our research and are sure it will pay off for them in the short-term – i.e., that they're very likely or nearly guaranteed a job in their field at graduation. And I do not support any of us going into debt to make that happen (as if I could even afford that).
For now, there is government money available to help with college expenses, and you betcha we'll take advantage of whatever we qualify for, short of loans if at all possible. That is one advantage the current crop of young people may have over generations to come – free government money for college.
But I think one of the most important things for parents to do is to set the expectation that college is not a given and not even appropriate for a number of career paths. Apprenticeships, internships, on-the-job training, mentorship, "career center" or technical school courses, self-study…all of those may be more prudent, effective, relevant paths to various careers.
My dad insisted that my sisters and I get college degrees. He did not have a degree, and his earning opportunities in his field (engineering) were severely limited by this. He ran a machine shop for decades and often spoke of correcting significant design errors made by the "white collars upstairs.") Ironically, my degree hasn't paid for itself (even after 18 years), and neither of my sisters are working in degree-related fields. But I do think that for my dad's generation, the logic was sound. It just wasn't for mine (Gen X) and it won't be for my kids.
The hard part for my oldest child right now is my asking him to narrow down his interests and envision what he might see himself doing as an adult so we can create an educational path for him that will likely lead to a job. My own generation didn't start addressing these questions until age 16 or so, and even in college (liberal arts, for me), we were encouraged to "explore" and "find ourselves" and so forth – we were not training for a job after graduation; we were simply "getting a degree." I think today's young people need to find their focus at a younger age so they can maximize their opportunities as efficiently and quickly as possible. I think many middle-class (and upper-class) young people graduate from high school (and sometimes even college) without it being on their radar that they need to be prepared to earn a living.
"Finding your career" is so often presented as a personal preference issue, not a realistic pay-the-bills issue.
Anyway, I have many thoughts on this as my family is right on the edge of these kinds of decisions and projections. I would love to hear from others who are in the same boat or who are close to those who are.
Thanks for the kind words and encouragement. I'm not too worried about the neighbor girl. She will make lemonade if things turn up lemons. I only wish I could talk her out of assuming the student debt that can't be discharged through bankruptcy.
The neighbor boy is a different issue. He has a loyalist personality. He will likely find something and stick with it (until it fails.) I just wish I could give him solid advice.
I didn't have too much of a clue of what I wanted to do when I was that age. But it was different then. Jobs were easy to find and opportunity was around every corner. Now, it is downright scary. I'm glad that I'm at the stage of life I'm at.
I will look forward to the next Q&A answer podcast. Hopefully, Chris and Adam can provide wise insights.