Well, I remain fascinated. We all continue to comment on what we think it all means, and where it is all headed…and, on the streets of my city, and in the stores, I see people making occasional comments about it all…but…everybody is just doing life normally, and nobody seems to be DOING anything about it. Oh, I don’t mean that some of us have not packed away gold and silver, and gotten completely out of debt, and started our nice backyard garden, and laid in a good supply of food and water, and maybe gotten a more efficient car…and…and…whatever else we can think of. Yea, I don’t all that too. But, what I mean is why hasn’t somebody taken action…to stop the stupidity that is occurring daily on Wall Street, in the government, and on and on…?
Or is it that, in truth, there’s really nothing anyone CAN do to stop it? Or, maybe, in truth, we really don’t know what to do, but talk. Is the truth that we are just doomed, and we’re all gonna keep on giving our take on it, but doing nothing about it, because (1) we don’t know what the heck to do, and/or (2) we’re afraid to draw too much attention to ourselves, or (3) surely, we don’ think…just maybe…in the long run, it won’t be as bad as we’re afraid it will be?
I have my excuse. I don’t know what else I can do. Do you have yours?
I don’t know what we could do at the national level; my guess is that, smart as he appears, Obama will not do a "triple E" speech and really "change" the system (which, of course, would resist massive change anyway). Working locally at least gives us all a chance for survival. I met with 50 or so local Obama team people who had worked actively for his campaign. (I was there only because I’m on an email list for the CSA Farm that let them use a frigid meeting room gratis, not because I worked on the campaign). They were all above 60, like me, most pretty sharp, our local state rep and newspaper editor, smart foks, were there, and a variety of agendas came up. The Obama team leaders said that 4000 teams like this were meeting to send a summary of ideas for the O team to vet in D.C. and make priorities. They quickly decided that local issues, which they could definitely influence, were even more important. Renewable energy, transportation, etc. were discussed and finally one guy stood up and said he’d be considered a wacko but talked about many triple E ideas. I stood up and said I’d raise him two wacko points and suggested that we form a "wacko subgroup". I said that I wanted them to tell Obama to use the words "post peak-oil economy" and was pleased when people listened and rolled the term over in their heads.
I have little hope for national changes but perhaps my local community can address the survival issues even if hypocrites and liars destroy the country.We’ll see what happens. I’ll keep you informed and welcome any suggestions. I will be attending the Rowe conference and hope to bring back some ideas.
SG
Yes, I did introduce myself to the gathering and provide my address, etc. I will consider unmasking here; several web incidents have made me cautious.
Ben, Great post! This is the exact discussion my girlfriend and I have every time I want to share the ongoing news that gets crazier every day. She can only take so much and gets angry because of the helpless feeling of not knowing what to do about it.
I, like you, don’t know what else to do. Protests seem futile, lawsuits take money, etc… It’s going against a very large machine that seems to have a lot of momentum and the general public doesn’t seem to care.
I think that getting people to watch The Crash Course and getting the word out that this is very, very serious is all we can do for the time being.
I have been getting a little more interest from friends after they watch this video and want to learn more which is a good start
Bill
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PIEGK0Ib…
Lisa,
I absolutely agree with your analogy between our fiat currency, fractional reserve banking and Madoff type schemes. Why our popular media do not report this connection is beyond me. The methodology is not too dissimilar it’s just the scale!
Stan
There are 3 destructive mechanisms at work in the world economy today.
At the time of America’s beginnings, the Founding Fathers knew very well, the dangers represented by all 3, and warned incessantly as to the likely outcome, should the United States allow their adoption. Unfortunately all 3 are now completely implemented in the USA, and at work to some degree everywhere else within the industrialized world.
These 3 mechanisms are:
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Fractional-reserve Banking
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Private Banking controlling issuance of the nation’s currency
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Irredeemable fiat-currency (currency secured by government force only, and not a valuable commodity, like gold & silver).
To understand (1), I suggest watching the following free Google Video, which describes the mechanism well:
"Money As Debt"
To understand (2), I suggest watching the following, also free on Google Video:
"The Money Masters (How International Banking Gained Control Over America)"
To understand (3), I suggest watching the following 2 Google videos:
"Creature From Jekyll Island"
and
"Fiat Empire (Why the Federal Reserve Violates the US Constitution"
For those not familiar with these aspects of monetary theory and it’s impact on history (politics and economics), watching these videos will be most enlightening.
While feeling a bit pedantic, the answer as to "what to do", in general terms, is:
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FOLLOW THE US CONSTITUTION, ARTICLE I, SECTIONS 8 & 10.
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Force Banks to stop (or sharply curtail) the practice of fractional-reserve Banking.
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Stop allowing a private Bank and Banking System, to issue the currency of the USA.
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Back the currency by gold and silver, and make it completely redeemable
It is testimony to either a excellent execution of a conspiratorial scheme, or complete incompetence on the part of the educational system (or both), that there is little to no knowledge, that the United States fought against these mechanisms from it’s inception.
While it may be frequently deemed a "quaint" document in discussion today, the fact is, the US Constitution was written in the context of discussion and arguments on these very problems.
History is replete with letters, documentation and record, of the fight the Founding Fathers (and beyond) had against the "3 Dangerous Mechanisms" being instituted within the United States, and the likely outcome should they not scribe in the US Constitution, exactly what the government was allowed to do. The last debate on these issues was lost in 1913, with smaller encroachments continuing since.
WHAT TO DO ABOUT IT:
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Educate yourself and your loved ones
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Protect your assets against the current and coming economic climate
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Write, phone and contact your government representatives
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Meet-up with others of similar persuasion, to discuss more detailed action
Thomas Jefferson - "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. Already they have raised up a moneyed aristocracy that has set the Government at defiance. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people to whom it properly belongs."
James Madison - "History records that the money changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling the money and its issuance."
John Adams - "All the perplexities, confusion and distress in America arise not from defects in their Constitution or Confederation, nor from want of honor or virtue, so much as downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit, and circulation."
John Adams - "Banks have done more injury to the religion, morality, tranquility, prosperity, and even wealth of the nation than they can have done or ever will do good."
Andrew Jackson - "Gentlemen, I have had men watching you for a long time and I am convinced that you have used the funds of the bank to speculate in the breadstuffs of the country. When you won, you divided the profits amongst you, and when you lost, you charged it to the bank. You tell me that if I take the deposits from the bank and annul its charter, I shall ruin ten thousand families. That may be true, gentlemen, but that is your sin! Should I let you go on, you will ruin fifty thousand families, and that would be my sin! You are a den of vipers and thieves. I intend to rout you out, and by the grace of the Eternal God, will rout you out"
Andrew Jackson (His Tombsone) - "I Beat the Bank!"
Mayer Rothschild - "Give me control of a nation’s money and I care not who makes the laws."
James Garfield - "The chief duty of the National Government in connection with the currency of the country is to coin money and declare its value. Grave doubts have been entertained whether Congress is authorized by the Constitution to make any form of paper money legal tender. The present issue of United States notes has been sustained by the necessities of war; but such paper should depend for its value and currency upon its convenience in use and its prompt redemption in coin at the will of the holder, and not upon its compulsory circulation. These notes are not money, but promises to pay money. If the holders demand it, the promise should be kept."
James Garfield - "Whoever controls the volume of money in any country is absolute master of all industry and commerce."
Woodrow Wilson - "We have restricted credit, we have restricted opportunity, we have controlled development, and we have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated, governments in the civilized world–no longer a government by free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and the duress of small groups of dominant men."
Franklin D Roosevelt - "The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the large centers has owned the government of the U.S. since the days of Andrew Jackson. History depicts Andrew Jackson as the last truly honorable and incorruptible American president."
I’m looking for some way to actually take action too. I protested with Ron Paul’s Campaign for Liberty on the End the FED day (11-22-08) but I was hoping that something even bigger than that could be formed. The problem seems to be uniting the many groups that share similar values and concerns. If every group that was concerned about the FED and fiat money, etc. could get together on at least that one issue, I think there would be a good number to stage a protest.
I encourage everyone on this site to SHARE any news you might have of future protests, events, or courses of action. I say as respectfully and humbly as possible that talk and discussion only go so far. Most of us understand the problems well enough to feel the need for action. Now we need to make some noise and bring others to that point.
Believe me, "Joe Sixpack" is not particularly warm to the Federal Reserve - he’s largely indifferent for the simple reason that he doesn’t know any better. But more and more people each day seem troubled by Paulson’s Plunder Package. Many would simply join the cause if they knew there WAS a cause.
-use facebook
-use bumper stickers
-talk to strangers (new friends) about it
-make your screen saver text say something useful (free advertising)
-if possible make your voicemail have a useful quotation or message
-make your e mail signature have a useful quotation or message (think of how many people this will reach)
-I’ve actually seen some FRNs that have messages written on them…now there’s an idea!
-present the Crash Course to your coworkers - repeatedly until everyone gets the message
I have been surprised at the very warm welcome I have received when expressing my opinion on these topics. America is not happy, but it doesn’t quite understand and it doesn’t have a true cause to unite behind. That’s where we come in.
the parallels to japan’s ‘lost decade’ are too convincing to ignore. if you agree that the asset-price bubble fueled by the decades of savings finally unleashed by the japanese is similar to the asset-price bubble fueled by greenspan-bernanke holding rates low and infusing cash, than i believe i can make a strong case here.
other than that we can see that interest rates plunged to zero, central banks bailed out (propped up) doomed financial institutions and companies, banks refused to lend for lack of quality investments, and the deflationary spiral. i’m starting to beleive we are in a long period of deflation and won’t see hyperinflation at all unless a miracle appears (like a drug that reverses aging), then controllling inflation will be like pulling an f-15 out of a flat spin.
I watched the first video so far and it covers much of what is discussed in "The Crash Course" with a few extra interesting details and compelling quotes from current and historical figures. My immediate thought after watching this video which is very well made and planned very well was:
BRING ON THE ASTEROID
Mike
[quote=Mike wrote]
This raises yet another question: Since fiat currency has sustained
itself in Japan over years and years with little to no growth, little
inflation, and low interest rates, what’s to say that at least in
theory, we couldn’t do that with a fiat system here? I despise the
manipulated paper standard we have, but I’m just curious if there’s a
difference between the way Japan handled no growth and the options we
have.[/quote]
Might this explain it?
Central Banking Inc is a small club. No single member wants to deviate from the norm. They do not want to fight the Fed and the Wall Street Banks. To maintain a competitive currency (for exports) they print yen. The locals have learned their lesson from the exploded bubble and have reverted to their natural instinct of buying only with money they have saved. The Wall Street Giants have taken up the excess yen and sprayed them around the globe (The Carry Trade). The Japanese behaved financially responsibly internally but provided the fuel (added to in increasing volume by the Chinese) for the Wests profligacy.
Stan
Here is an analysis of Japan’s decade plus recession and stagnation. An excellent analysis from the Austrian perspective that destroys the Monetarist and Keynesian points of view. A read worth your time, and fitting for this topic. It is a great example of what we should not be doing, even though we are really in deflationary times at the moment the article still applies.
GDon, I appreciate your answers as to what to do. I agree with all of them. However, I am an individual, and there is only so much that one person can do (mostly for himself and his own family) against the evil giant that is reeking havoc at the national level. When I have written (probably a hundred now) letters to various members of the congress, I eventually get back these phony-baloney answers that essentially say "I’m so glad you contacted me about so and so Ben. And how about signing up for my monthly newsletter…blah…blah…blah." But, what can I expect? These people are all bought and paid for too. So, for me to hope that they’re gonna really REALLY stand up and cause a stir is ridiculous. You see what happened when Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich tried to get something moving in the congress. All the other big shots just essentially humored them.
And I really enjoyed your quotes from famous folks. Some of them I had not heard, and they were great. So, now, I’ve got the knowledge I need. But I don’t see that its getting my country anywhere. Maybe I should just wait for the tax revolutions that are bound to start within a year or so, when folks with houses that have lost 50% in value start getting tax notices that say their home’s value has increased 30%, or 40% or more. That might be just what it takes, to get the unemployed to join with them, and get in the streets, and (maybe literally) throw the bums out. By that time, Obama would have had a couple or three years to work his magic, which, by the way, is NOT goihg to work. We’re too far gone! Look for a third party candidate to take the presidency in 2012.
Meantime, I guess I’ll just keep reading Chris, and you guys and gals, every day…and sit in a comfy chair, by the fire, with a nice snifter of brandy and some good music. (Doesn’t sound too bad, I guess)
Ben
[quote]Lisa said:
"…our entire mess is the result of a huge (and multiple) Ponzi scheme. Just like Madoff’s scheme, our financial system came crashing down because the source of new funds dried up and the scheme could no longer be churned…"
Stan said:
"Lisa,
I absolutely agree with your analogy… The methodology is not too dissimilar it’s just the scale! "
[/quote]
Stan and Lisa, I think it here, you type it there. We’re all in perfect agreement, and I made the same point yesterday (https://peakprosperity.com/comment/8796#comment-8796)
Consider this: Imagine you are one of Madoff’s victims. Some magical thing occurs such that you receive your statement and it shows your original balance; that is to say, you haven’t lost a cent. You can’t believe it! You call Madoff’s office and a magical secretary confirms your money is there. What are you going to do at that moment–after having suffered the scare of your life, thinking that you had lost everything and were going to have to work until the day you die?
Well, I think you can consider Paulson and Bernanke’s reckless actions as the "magical thing" on a market scale (making the market go back to where it was). The baby boomers are like Madoff’s victims who thought they lost everything.
What we are going to witness in the coming weeks? months? is a schizophrenic wretching of the market as the baby boomers compete with Paulon’s Inner Gang to get their money out of the market first–before it gets Madoffized. The only way that Paulson and Bernanke can get away with levitating the market is if the rest of the world doesn’t understand that they are doing all the work. Think about it: Let’s say you’re a contractor; you build houses. You build me a house. You hand me a bill. While standing right in front of you, I take a ream of paper, put it into a strange looking machine, turn the crank on the machine, cut the paper that comes out of the machine into currency-sized pieces, then hand the paper to you in payment for the house you just built for me.
This type of behavior cannot go on much longer, as the people who are doing all the work are far better educated (on average) than the people who are turning the crank on the strange machine…
everyone on this site:
Mike "Mish" Shedlock is going to be organizing an effort to abolish the FED in January. Yes, I know this is a monumental task but you have to begin somewhere. I suggest you go to his website globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com and read about it.
How about a Recovery Course to compliment the Crash Course?
I’m not implying Chris spend another 3 years unilaterally developing the Recovery Course. However, I am suggesting organizing and leveraging the talents of the folks that frequent this site to create some positive energy and coordinated action. Most of the time when I walk away from reading posts herein, I find I have a negative attitude. That is rubbing off on my family, friends, and peers. I have shared this site with others, and they are having similar challenges. Negativity breeds negativity.
As I find myself unable to sleep again (after reading some posts tonight), I thought about how to structure a Recovery Course and make it actionable on a broad scale. Forgive me for the crudeness of this. Please focus on the concept of a Recovery Course and generating some coordinated action.
It seems to me that a Recovery Course ought to have at least three key components:
-
A unifying vision that the users can rally around - e.g. return to the Constitution; values/virtues/principles/character/common sense etc… are rewarded etc…
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Solution concepts and simple priorities for each of three E’s that the users can help propogate. For example, in the Crash Course, Chris talks about alternative energy sources and shows a curve of which solutions yield the best return. He points out that our elected officials are currently providing the greatest funding for the least viable alternative (ethanol) on the chart. Fact-based data should be central to prioritizing the different solutions.
-
A unified set of messaging/action tools. This will take some thought, but with a little work, can be done. For example, on the messaging front, if the users of this site had the ability to log on every day or so and print off a letter and/or email and send it: a.) to their elected officials, b.) to a national media outlet that might publish it and c.) to a local reporter that might publish it, the user base of this site would increase and the number of informed folks pushing for some common sense solutions would increase. Assuming we could track and encourage the frequent downloads of these letters (much like Chris has done for overall website activity), there would be a sense of ‘doing something positive’ for our country. As this process grows and the elected officials and media folks are continually inundated with the same message, they may eventually respond beyond just a standardized ‘form letter response’. Note that this is an example of a very inexpensive means of providing a coordinated effort. I would also posit that the messages would have at least two varieties: a.) messages re: current legislative activities, and b.) proactive messages re: solutions outlined in #2. This same concept can apply to many other ‘actionable’ activities that are part of the Recovery Course.
I recognize that it was easy for me to type these ideas. Executing will take additional commitment. However, my point is that this particular thread has some ideas for solutions, which are sorely needed. I also enjoyed the 12/13/08 post on Heroes in Action. We need to get on the same general page and do our part to resolve these problems. Like the commercials for Lowes say: Let’s build something together.
Perhaps this can be discussed when many convene in Rowe in February.
Joe
I personally feel that educating folks is the best thing, and the only thing to do.
I truly feel that trying to fix this is akin to them monkeying with trying to fix the banks, the big 3 and God knows what else.
Let it (the dollar) fail, the sooner it goes bust the sooner we will have a balanced budget, there is no way in hell we are going to ever pay down that debt. 53++ trillion off balance entitlements and 11 trillion on the books. Fixing that is like Paulson and Bernanke fixing the economy, it ain’t going to happen.
As long as they rebuild the system minus the insanity (the Fed, a bloated govt, and an economy based on stripping the Earth of every resource) we stand a miniscule chance.
I think pumping large amounts of money will increase the worth of gold when the dollar collapses. It can be a strategy to make the current reserves in gold worth more than ever. So when the collapse happened the one with the most gold has the power. All other who have dollars as a reserve have nothing.
Randall: What is the exact link for Mish’s End the FED site? I have a number of friends that I think would jump in and I should be able to get a little more publicity in some other circles as well.
As for the recent posts, I agree: the 2 things that need to happen are 1) End the Fed and 2) return to the Constitution. Really just returning to the Constitution would cover the Fed too, but apparently Congress doesn’t realize this.
I just heard Mr. Barack on the radio this morning telling us that it’s important that the Fed remain an "independent body." He said that they Fed’s tools are starting to run out and now we’re going to have to make some changes ourselves. On the surface this sounds benign, but if this is some sort of 1-2 punch in which the Fed inflates like mad and now they prepare us accept it and work harder to deal with the rising prices, I refuse to comply quietly. They will not inflate away my (our) wealth and have me remain docile
Mike: Yah might want to read Romer’s papers - she has talked about quickly re-issueing currencies. I’d say this (destruction of dollar and a new buck) are as close to a sure bet as one could get.
I couldn’t agree more with you (or Ron Paul) on the Constitution - having said that - the best thing that could happen is for our dollar to tank, it will destroy our debt. SS and Medicare are insolvent, there is NO fix for them.
Hyperinflation in dismal, you can protect yourself from it, being taxed to death and being in debt to death is, in my humble opinion, a helll of a lot worse.
The response I get from family members is similar to what I recall a journalist describing when he witnessed Mt Saint Helens erupting (he was quite close). He said it was so utterly profound and beyond what his mind could handle all at once that he had to turn away from it and not look. Difference here is we can’t run from this unfolding disaster (well, not as easily as the journalist anyway). So everyone I have told so far reacts like "Well give me another drink while the Titanic sinks".