Hi Mike,
You are right. Most people will not see this. And if people do, they will have to resolve their cognitive dissonance…
Grts, Dave.
So Carl, you join sometime in the early morning hours of June 9, EDT and write 3 posts, all of which are focused on claiming China’s innocence. As far as I am concerned (and probably nearly everyone else here), you are an agent of the CCP until you prove otherwise. That would be hard to do short of a face to face meeting.
There is so much more complexity and important topics to discuss than your narrowly focused efforts to proclaim the CCP’s innocencel
At least in this video, all he says is that they’re sequencing coronaviruses, taking the spike protein out, and putting it into “pseudoparticles” (likely just meaning small artificial blobs of lipids to hold the spike protein) and then testing to see if they can infect human cells with the goal of finding which viruses are likely to make the jump from animals to humans. They then go out and test whether people already have antibodies to those viruses.
They may be doing gain-of-function research but not from this video.
Video didn’t say anything about doing gain-of-function research, just described trying to find which spike proteins bind strongly to human cells in order to see which coronaviruses are likely to jump to humans.
Hi exam1n3,
Thanks for your feedback. Could you explain his words from 0:32 to 0:48 seconds?
Especially the last statement “with each step you move closer to this virus can become pathogenic to people”. What are these steps? Blind trials of yet another natural spike protein? That to me doesn’t sound like science but like gambling, there cannot be any convergence towards more infectious viruses.
Edited: did I mention gain of function?
Grts, Dave.
Gee, what could go wrong……?
@MarkNZed
Yes, it is true that the Chinese people are not to blame in particular, or that their government has them under constant surveillance and feeding them a constant stream of propaganda to which they are either reluctant participants or naive followers.
In the US, particularly where I live near seattle, there is a huge population of Chinese nationals. I work with and around plenty and in conversation with them, they actually believe the Chinese lies, despite plentiful access to contrary information. Call it what you will there, but those high social credit score individuals China allows to travel, are true believers.
In China itself is where the sceptics live. And those are the oppressed, those are the lower classes not allowed to work because they don’t trust the government, and those are the ones I think you are referring to. They are not the majority, any more than the anti-vaccine crowd anywhere else is. Once companies start requiring vaccination (and it is literally days or weeks away where I’m at) the resistance will break and more people will get vaccinated to their peril. Once the true consequences hit, people by and large will conform no matter what their brain or gut or sense of looming dread and their soul leaving them aghast at the catastrophic decision they have made.
I don’t know if there’s been an actual study done on it, but I’d say that less than 10% of people are willing to bear the consequences of their defiance. I haven’t yet been tested that way so even I don’t know if I have that courage. So even if 10% of nazi’s were true believers, and another 30% were supportive, another 20% were reluctant, and another 30% were shamed into serving. A full 90% of their society still participated in the atrocities they committed. So they are not cleansed of their culpability. I think China faces the same ratio and so do all our countries.
But you’re right, there are good people in China who don’t buy in, they are just doing what they have to to survive, so to say “China did it” should be known to not include those people. But those who weild the power did, those who blindly support China did. Those who are reluctant followers did, if only through their silence. And those who allowed shame or economic opportunity to silence them did too, if only through their muted objections. In any group there are few who truly stand apart with integrity and clear vision willing and able to endure the forces of compliance, and those who don’t aren’t treated any more kindly by history. So those good middle class people in China are only there because they are compliant, and they too bear their portion of responsibility, just as we all do for our collective sins.
Edit: This is why we are on this forum to find out our own collective guilt and to purge those who violated our right to a clear conscience. To find the truth and to find out who is guilty, and to punish them, regardless of affiliation. We are here to seek justice for the dead.
Hi Dave,
unfortunately I have to agree. A few month ago I read an Pro-Vaccination article (unfortunately I cannot find anymore) where the research doctor enthusiastically praised how fast we came up with an vaccine due to our modern research & gene technology… and then he said “… and currently due to this advanced technology we are working on vaccines for viruses that even do not exist yet - but potentially in future. In this way we will have vaccines against many viruses ready for deployment immediately and can stop the pandemic right in its track.”
I was flabbergasted… what could go wrong and from where would we know that nature would ever come up with that what we can create? And Covid is probably the first result of this.
But when I showed this article to a colleague he was pleased to read this, but when I expressed my concern because… how can you verify the efficiency and safety of a vaccine against a virus that does not exist - except you create it - he could not follow me and just brushed my concerns off…
@Chris:
“Koop” in Koopmans you pronounce as “cope” as in scope, hope.
Not as coupe.
“You create and insert…”
adding this to the discussion.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-spain-science-idUSKBN23X2HQ
I havent watched the video yet, so may be talking out of hand. To my mind this should be about virology and GOF and how stupid it would be to do this research.
Wherever and however it was funded, or who did the work isnt the root issue. I believe its fairly well established that the US funded a bunch of the work completed at WIV?
If reckless, intentional perhaps criminal activity occurred to complicate, stall, obstruct, mislead and worsen the effect of an already deadly and reckless activity then it indeed should be about those who engaged in all those verbs. Society erects rules and punishments for activity to hopefully dissuade that activity Accomplice liability is an ancient concept
This article makes absolutely no sense when the widespread testing taking place didn’t show cases until much later. Once they started looking for it, suddenly they had respiratory cases everywhere? Given the trajectory of the case rate and the steady CFR, the spanish government would have inquired much sooner as to why there was a huge spike in pneumonia like cases, and given their early treatment protocols it would have been a much higher CFR than there was. Unless there is widespread evidence from multiple countries and regions without a bias either way, I think its difficult to say this is conclusive evidence and not cross contamination, especially considering that the sample they received would have been a very tiny fraction of the overall sewage line which when compared to deaths would have been difficult to capture without widespread contamination and the associated deaths that went with it. If the data shows Spanish hospitals overwhelmed by respiratory diseases in early 2020, then it’s plausible, but it seems like a narrative to exhonerate the Chinese.
Back about a year ago a Dr. Mayer posted a very detailed trail of the virus showing it as most likely lab made. In the time line he talks about the virus being sent to the US for sequencing around 2013.
https://peakprosperity.com/forum-topic/scientific-history-of-ratg13/
With so many problems seen today, Prisoners Dilemma always seems to play such a big role, and yet is isnt talked about much.
As I watch Fauchi talk during the senate testimony, he may as well just be saying. We have to persue GOF research because if we dont then china or russia will, so we have to get there first.
The same dilemma is being played out WRT general AI development. If we dont develop, then someone else will.
Same with AGW climate. If we dont emit, then someone else will and then we lose in the GDP race.
This is a race to the bottom from what I can tell.
Are you jealous that only the most connected and well paid virologists get to do Gain-of-Function research? Well, by getting vaccinated with non-sterilizing (means you can still harbor the virus) mRNA, you literally turn your body into a gain-of-function laboratory. By equipping your body with narrow, spike-protein-based immunity, you put the virus under what is called, “selection pressure”! This is exciting because you are battling that damn virus right there in your own body! The evolutionary kinetics are much slower if you fight the virus with natural, naive immunity… so you won’t be putting the virus under selection pressure. Doesn’t “selection pressure” sound like something you would like to do to that damn virus? Well you can! Get vaccinated today and pressure that damn virus!
Sarcasm off. Cases rising in the UK… the population-level serial passage experiment through folks offering spike protein selection pressure is ON folks;
https://twitter.com/Covid19Crusher/status/1402572059537031172
To my ear, Chris has a bit of an accent. I think he pronounces this name right within his dialect. To me, his speech flows well, though different from mine and perhaps yours. Maybe ours is wrong.
I’ll add some credence to this:
I’m not sure how widely shared gene sequences and things like the RaTG virus is. I’d think it is pretty prevalent especially when writing research papers and needing peer review and method reproduction to validate results. So the RaTG thing is no smoking gun to me.
But the fact that China is more open to and willing to sacrifice its population, to me makes it a researchers dream when faced with ethical concerns from research control boards. Hence the fauci -> daszak connection. Its the same thing Bill Gates did with AIDS research in Africa. Its easier to test experimental drugs on people outside FDA control and its easier to get to a breakthrough without the inconvenience of ethical reviews etc. Gates was lauded as a great philanthropist until all this. So the benefits are clear as to why US agents were involved in Wuhan. It doesn’t explain or excuse their intent or what benefit there was to it given the outcomes, but two years ago this was “just science”.
Sounds like a midwestern->yankee transplant to me. Can’t trust em.
Apparently there’s a northwest accent too, like a mix of surfer “hey brah” and “aww shucks” midwesterner but I can’t hear it. Probably can’t trust us either…