So It's Back To First Principles (Part 1)

Is it possible that Dutch’s Shot2 cleared the rail and hit the JCB tank?
(Dutch said his bullet went in, and came out his right side).

John Cullen posted a higher res version of the same hydraulic line on X back in February.

Here’s his full photo:

And here’s a version I made where I cropped it some and rotated it to match the 65 degree angle it was at. I had thought it was 70 degrees, but I was looking at the north telehandler, and I also may have been fooled by looking at picture that wasn’t very close to a side-on view.


When it’s only at a 65 degree angle it doesn’t look like the bullet was ascending, it looks more level or even descending.

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Yes, I will present the way I conducted the simulation. As always, if something appears incorrect, we can review it together and make any necessary corrections.

I used the manufacturing drawings and the photos from the video to reconstruct the most critical components for this simulation. The dimensions of the elements can be seen here:

I placed the hydraulic gray block in an approximate position to help with orientation, because once you start rotating these elements, it’s easy to lose track. :grinning:

To determine the theoretical height of the shot impact, I used this drawing:

I positioned the boom at a 65° inclination and oriented it based on the photo, as the speakers were tilted toward the audience. I also accounted for the sea level difference and placed the impact point at the calculated height. It is a tricky task, since the picture provided by @daniel59 is not perfect top view. Some intepretation was necessary.

Next, I drew the trajectory of the shot coming from the bleachers and exported these elements into a separate CAD model for more detailed analysis.



Visually, the result looks strikingly similar to the photo, which strongly suggests to me that the shot originated from the bleacher side. One observation I made is that the relatively large projectile impacted a relatively small pipe, striking its upper half. This could explain why the burr was pushed outward toward the outer diameter, resulting in an irregularly shaped hole. This might also help explain the direction of the hydraulic oil flow. This part of the analysis is beyond my technical expertise, so I welcome input from others in the forum.

However, if the shot had hit the very top of the tube (at its highest point), I would expect a much more symmetrical impact, likely with burrs distributed evenly around the circumference.

I used the 0.3-inch diameter for the projectile, as you provided.

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@roger-knight

Did the bullet fly over the railing or through the banner if Crooks or one of the vents are assumed to be the origin?

@sonjax6 @kincses-zsolt @roger-knight

Who owns the banners? Perhaps there were bloodstains on the banner in the top corner of the right bleacher and the owner kept this piece because of that?

The bodycam footage of these two police officers could show what we are looking for.

@roger-knight

Can you narrow down the places where the banner could have bullet holes?

Where can I find the complete video for this picture?

@LmBubba from Twitter (https://x.com/LmBubba) seems to be able to find almost anything:

Is the bald man wearing a bodycam?

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Recently I learned something.
A suspect here was interrogated as witness. Guess why.

A witness not allowed to deny the answer and not allowed to lie.
Art of lawfare.

When the individual turned to west, the shot 10 could reach his neck from left and behind. Yesterday I found a video when Zaliponi was aiming his rifle, We might better identify his position. Perhaps he made the mouth wound. It is all damn complicated.

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The proof of the pudding is in the eating.

As a mathematician, you are used to solving everything through abstract thinking.

For once, you could also just buy a pipe and drill a hole in it so that it corresponds to a northern firing angle and then fill it with water and pressurize it.

He does not seem to have gone any further in the following position.

Until someone releases a distant drone footage…

I can read a different story from the pictures.
Zaliponi made the mouth wound by his 11 o’clock direction.
Due to that shot the individual lost his coordination/orientation skills. Tried to raise his head, but at that moment he was not entirely aware where he was. Then collapsed. Maybe the 10th shot didn’t reach him at all. He just collapsed as a result of intense bleeding.


Look at his neck. I think that redish something might be blood.

Perhaps I should not spend time to identify the object. There are trees, and the higher building from right to the roof being washed. And there is a pile structure I never ever seen.

When shot 10 rang out his head was tirned to west.
Indeed the dead shot might be made by Zaliponi.


From south barn the shot wound would had been from left and behind on his neck.

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Yes, I started watching videos about the railings corner shot.

(Sorry, I must go to work now. I’ll be back later to answer furter questions.)

Let’s keep the impact of the bullet on the hydraulic system and the origin of the shot as two separate topics—otherwise things get too confusing.

Before we move on to the origin of Shot 3, I’d like to run a simulation based on this quote:

@sonjax6, would you like to propose a specific bullet trajectory that we should verify?

Or should I simulate the scenario as shown in the video—where the shot comes from between the two snipers and aligns with the direction of the hydraulic flow (i.e., towards the tents)?

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Which video are you looking for? I was able to find both—from the images above:

At first glance, I couldn’t see any gunshots, but I did notice some blood:

A team like Medical Detectives would probably figure out where the shot came from just by analyzing the blood drops! :smile:

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Could it have come out of Dutch’s right side, over the rail, and through the aluminum?
(looks possible, from Corey’s video frames)



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probably https://youtu.be/W2NebZZfCCg?t=4775
I try to find.

EDIT:
https://player.odycdn.com/v6/streams/3b0e6bbe92c2b4f3527a4b786d3dea53cba00320/219b5e.mp4

#https://player.odycdn.com/v6/streams/3b0e6bbe92c2b4f3527a4b786d3dea53cba00320/219b5e.mp4


https://x.com/HeadlineUSA/status/1944538926481375393/photo/1

@rob-banks please look at this



I think he was more climbed, seen on dashcam than it looks on his bodycam.
#https://youtu.be/W2NebZZfCCg?t=1873
From behind it looks his leg or at least his knee was on the roof.

This figure is so bad.