Yeah, that kind of stuff. One that sticks in my head is something from CNN about how GN “bounded down the stairs” and opened the door, and just then, two cars pulled up, etc. It seemed like they were trying hard to portray leaving a post for no good reason as heroic.
3 Likes
I’ll have to go back and check the WTAE times. To be honest, I think I was using a time from a given frame screenshot, and not necessarily the first appearance.
Good catch! Thanks. Damn, how did I miss that? Eye strain, dirty glasses? Corrected and I’ll update the post.
Yes, there is a conflict between the 18:12 map and the 18:06-18:12 timeline entry. The building 4 location to me was a misplacement in the map. Is there even a door at the NW corner of bldg. 4? I’ll have to see if Spa Guy’s footage captures that wall.
2 Likes
I think it was a misplacement on the map. There is no door or window in that corner. Besides, that was after shots were fired, and I was only capturing up to the roof access time. That’s the line of demarcation between my maps, as you know.
My first cup of coffee is helping me remember. I went with the time you had for the start when you were trying to find the song. Thanks for the turnaround time. If you mentioned these times in a previous post and I missed it or was just satisfied going with the start time, the turnaround time jumps out at me now as a key data point. Thanks for pushing it.
Me either, and that’s something I held back, my detailed assessment of their possible movements other than what the timeline datapoints show, because anything else would be speculation… That 14 minute gap between photos has me curious. I was expecting to see texts and/or comms during that time because of his “The first thing I did, I sent those pictures out,” statement, or at least ABC’s reporting of it.
1 Like
Before charging either one of them of lying under oath you need to question both under oath and also ask additional witnesses. Me thinks almost nobody is willing to do that – except perhaps the lawyers of the injured and killed at that day.
What we need are bodycam footage, with sound, of officers on the west side and ESU who went inside the building. In particular that officer who interacted with the civilians on the west side.
1 Like
I wrote something about the coms delay six days ago when I leaned about the WP Police Radio Transmissions protocol. It’s disturbing indeed. I’d be faster comminicating with my bushtelephone (as in Crocodile Dundee).
This is the CNN article.
‘Could it have been avoided?’ Local cops detail breakdown in efforts to stop Trump’s would-be assassin | CNN Politics
In my understanding, the article doesn’t say they pulled up with a (or two) car(s), maybe they pulled up walking? Maybe one of these guys was this Ground Cop, who just happened to miss Crooks passaging the roof, in the Thumbnail of Jeff Ostroff’s video.
Has someone identified those in the groups? Did it have Butler as well as Beaver ESU in it? I wonder because you just put the thought in my head of finding out if GN’s sending of the photos coincided with the Butler ESU walking out from the north barn (bldg 15) area. The guy who I believe took shot 9 was standing near where he took the shot for some time, but the rest were congregated in front of the barn. What got them to move out? It’s the same question as what caused Hercules 1 to turn north.
Whoa, I could have blinked, but why do you have a sniper now at the NW corner of Building 4 overlooking the (northern) alcove?! Or are you just eliminating this as a possibility?
If I’m right, somebody did enhance the message screenshot with some names, but can’t tell right now who or when. Must be a while ago, probably close after Grassley released those screenshots (Jul 29)
Not sure if there was Butler and Beaver mixed in the chat group but I would assume so. One group was Sniper Group (I think the one with 7 people) and the other was BCESU Commander Group (I think the one with 8 people)
2 Likes
I don’t. That’s a graphic from the Butler County After Report that I’m proving to be inaccurate at best, or misinformation at worst.
“M” would be in there at the very least, right? From Butler I mean.
I’m not sure, unfortunately there’s no indicator for names in the sniper chat. In the BCESU Commander Group is beside Greg Nicol somebody with S and somebody with P.
But M “Roger that” was in Jason Wood’s Chat Group. I would assume that was a chat group of the AGR snipers only. Beside Wood also Greg Nicol and M in this group. Since Wood and Nicol are Beaver County, I would conclude M to be Butler.
2 Likes
What is the source of dashcam M500-016197? Is this only a still image or do we have footage? First time I saw this one.
Just noting that in slide 2 in the top screenshot, the front vehicle stopped in this position at 18:09:02, as seen in M500-010482. The second patrol car to the left in the top image stopped about the same time as seen in BWC2-122111. 18:08:36 was the moment the two patrol cars was parked next to each other at the base of the water tower.
Edit: We should also take into account that the timeline is between 18:06 and 18:12. It is possible that the two vehicles GN was mentioning are among the three vehicles that was parked at the east end of the parking lot, the vehicles where Stewerd eventually was hiding behind. They could have arrived there between 18:02 and 18:08
The 2 vehicles the report is pointing to, 1 marked and 1 unmarked, are the ones in the dashcam below, at 19:04. You would be hard pressed to go to meet them from a room with no door, when the two vehicles likely weren’t parked there at 18:12, and when you are also on your way to door 9 where 2 vehicles are already parked, 1 marked and 1 unmarked. Last I checked, you can’t walk outside with no door, you can’t meet vehicles that aren’t there at the time, and you can’t be in two places at once. But I could be wrong. 
Either the evidence and I are wrong, or the AAR is.
I did have the bodycam references in slide 2 messed up. I fixed them.
At the end of the day we are trying to give GN the benefit of the doubt. We are unsure what vehicles and officers he is talking about and could be any of these three pairs. The truth is that it just does not make sense for GN to go downstairs nor the timelines he stated. Period. He had a radio, he had text groups and he had a job to do. Give overwatch and keep an eye on the persons of interest. He failed.
Now we are twisting into Pretzels playing their twister game of logic, but the SS failed to adequately secure AGR with resources, the Overwatch failed to monitor the AGR area and the LEOs failed to engage Crooks. In my opinion in that order the magnitude of failure can be attributed to. SS made the biggest mistakes, Overwatch second and LEOs the least trying to scramble and get things done.
After this rant, sorry btw, on a side note, do we actually have a name for the person who assigned the snipers into the building instead of on top of it? Only mention is Bravo Team Leader gave out the assignments in the morning at 09:00.
4 Likes