Just so I’m sure what to work on, what time does the critical audio happen? From about 7:07 to when?
1 Like
@brian60221 The total exchange goes from 07:09 to 08:14 (Greg leaves).
The “Hey, Greg” by the end of the exchange is at 07:45.
1 Like
I think GN said “I wasn’t there”. I agree about “first burst”.
I think somebody asks him something like “that connected?”
1 Like
Here is a back tracing of the bullet from the height of its contact at the top of the bleachers, to Trump’s ear height, all the way back to the distance of Crooks’ position.
Obviously it is a straight line path, and obviously bullets have a curved path, but it is a good guide nonetheless.
If you know your trigonometry and study it carefully, it should make sense.
The bottom line is: The straight-line path of the bullet extended back to the distance of Crook’s is some 14.09 feet above ground. About 1.6 feet below Crooks’ elevation on top of the building. It is a fair match that within a small margin of error supports the view that Crook’s fired at least the first 3 shots, if not all 8.
These elevations proposed does not make sense to me.
If you look at this frame from TMX you can see Trump and, in the back, you can see James.
This frame is taken at 1.65m above ground. I know this because TMX is using the gap in the fence to film Trump.
Here is the gap on DJstew footage:
The other way around from James footage you can see people walking near the fence at the same line of sight of trump ear elevation. This way its proven that James was not sitting down on the bleachers at time of this footage.
If the bullet came from that line of sight from the wall of building 6 it would pass at the elevation of James footage which is 0.5m above the rail. Keep in mind that yellow line crosses the top of the window. If the shoot was taken from below that line then the fire would pass way above James head.
If the line of fire hit the rail and Trump years the correct elevation is from Crooks position.
1 Like
Thank you for providing such detailed information, which I would like to review thoroughly.
Just for my general understanding, which method did you use to determine the sea levels?
I follow you because you are precise and studious, And slow to the task. fyi
Good catch. Obviously there is some body language. But I cannot hear any words.
This means that the audio sources must be time-synchronized, right?
Why does this have to be done with shots 9 and 10?
Why wouldn’t Trump’s speech over the loudspeakers have been sufficient? Their exact location is known.
@michael-yon @sgt-raven @daniloraf @howdoiknowthisinfo
Is it theoretically possible to build a silencer that reduces the muzzle blast so much that shots from a second shooter would not be heard on the audio recordings if he had fired at the right times?
I am thinking of a stationary, non-mobile silencer. Could theoretically have a volume of one cubic meter. With something like that, a second shooter might have been able to shoot through a small hole in the front of Building 6 or the rear two-story building. Then the trajectories would have been on top of each other.
In this scenario, Crooks would have fired blanks, which would have produced the muzzle blast.
By radio (Crooks’ gun was rigged to send a signal when the trigger was pulled), the second shooter could have fired at the right time so that the sonic boom of the second gun and the muzzle blast of the first gun matched on the audio recordings.
The rear two-storey building is particularly interesting in this respect because
-
an opening would already have been present
-
there would have been more space for a huge silencer than in building 6
-
this building had no number on the security plan, as if none of them were supposed to be there
-
it could be assumed that no spectators should have been in the parking lot during Trump’s speech
-
it could be assumed that no one was filming the wall of this building during Trump’s speech
-
this could explain why it took Nicol two minutes to get out of Building 6
-
regarding the kayfabe theory, Building 6 could have been a physical barrier between Trump and the gun
Yes, exactly they need to be synchronized, indirectly TDOA method is doing that. I have thought about speech synchronizing. There is a lot of issues with that. First the sound is amplified by two speakers at different locations so you would have to differentiate that. Second the amplified sound hits Trump mic again so that is amplified again in the speakers with a delay of around 0.1 sec.
So, in the mic of Ross for example there is at least four different waves of speech reaching his cellphone at around 0.1s, 0.2s and 0.3s after the first speech wave.
Third, the report is a very recognizable sound with a specific frequency also of higher intensity (loud) that contrasts easily from the noise (people streaming). Forth, the signal from the report is a pulse that makes easy to mark the time of start, we are talking about differences in the 1/10000 of a second the result in errors in distance of less than 0.1m at the speed of the sound.
Fifth, the speaker from the south is hit by one of the bullets and its position is altered because the lift valve loses pressure.
I also have thought about synchronizing the videos, but the video usually are 30 frames per second that gives an error of 10m between frames, and you have to assume that the audio and video are perfectly synchronized.
3 Likes
Why should has he fired blanks? - That doesn’t compute. Uh, wait.
#https://youtu.be/SZHiqNUuEQI?t=5
1 Like
Why should he have assumed he could shoot at Trump after running across 4 rooftops for 30 seconds in broad daylight and then lying on the roof for 2 minutes?
Great question.
Why did he try to pass through the magnetometers - with rangefinder but without weapon?
But it does make already sense if it was a signal - I’m here.
1 Like
I’m trying to develop a new method for locating the origin of the shots. The method consists in:
1- Obtain the distance from a specified location of the first shot estimate the delta time to synchronize the times of the shot sequence.
2- Then at any other location create a grid where will be tested the specified shot delta time correction subtract from the time from the first calculation.
3- Then this delta time in absolute value is converted to meters for each receiver.
4- Finally, the medium value of error in meters is plotted on the grid.
My results are presented below:
the grid is 4x4 meters with 0.08m between the grids.
Assumptions:
1- Shot 1 came from Crooks Muzzle.
2- Grid center for shot 2 to 8 is Crooks Muzzle geolocation
3- Grid center for shot 9 is the SWAT officer geolocation.
4- Bullet times used from @offtheback:
5- Geolocations from my study.
Bullet 2:
Bullet 3:
Bullet 4:
Bullet 5:
Bullet 6:
Bullet 7:
Bullet 8:
Bullet 9:
Conclusions:
Considering a medium error of 1.4m all bullets from 1 to 8 came from the same location.
Bullet 9 came from the SWAT officer in the middle with a medium error of 2.5m.
Could not evaluate bullet 10 because there is too much error in the report time.
The conclusions are the same of @greg_n work. With different time data then Greg and with a different method.
I did not define the location of the shooter yet. But will work on it. But is for sure that all first 8 bullets came from the same place.
edit: inverted the grid 7 with 9.
2 Likes
Hi @vt1 maybe I don’t understand your heat map. Shots 4-8 look far up and to the left from shot 1. What does up and to the left mean? And does .2 mean .2 meters?
I would suggest you seed it with shot 4 and Crooks’ location and see what that gets you.
Sorry for the lateness of the reply. Those two images show grass that is at least 70% overlapping. In the lower image there is a grouping of 4 clover with the bottom clover underneath the @ “watermark”. In the upper image, that grouping of clover is still there, shifted straight upward perhaps 35% of the height of the screenshot. All the other features in the bottom half of the lower shot are translated upward and are less in focus in the second shot.
Dayve is in process of either moving or turning his phone downward. If I make a concerted effort I can make a cell phone do a 180 degree turn in about 1/5 of a second. So it wouldn’t be hard to turn a phone 30 degrees in 1/30 of a second, or one frame. That’s almost certainly more than is what is shown here.
By the way, I was stunned to see Eli Crane bring up the second shooter question at the congressional hearing on Thursday. He has a lot of guts. He suggested the committee bring up John Cullen, which I think would be a mistake. John Cullen has been more than a little incautious at times.
The grid is a map of 4x4m with the north pointing up.
So most shots from 2 to 8 are to West and North of the Muzzle geolcation (in the center).
The value in the grid is the error of the method in meters. The error is the medium error of 6 sources.
You can use this image on Google Earth with the side been 4m and put on Crooks muzzle position to see the predicted locations of each shot.
1 Like
OK. It still seems like if you seed it with the wrong location, things won’t be quite right.
I am working on the premise that Crooks took shot 4 (as the five shot super fast burst seems like a rookie move), using that to sync sources, and then I don’t have to look for shots 5-8 (the last 5 all come from the same place).
Playing around with different groups of sources, if I use sources 2-4, shots 1-3 want to resolve to around 8-9m east of Crooks and 5.5-6m south of Crooks. So in the building.
But that isn’t a better fit for the three crowd sources or DJStew, which prefer more due south of Crooks (but in the building). So trying to understand the differences as to why the east sources want to pull the estimate more east and all the south sources want to pull the estimate more south.
I wonder some times if the estimate for Crooks’ location isn’t quite right. Is your estimate the end of the gun barrel (which is where the sound would emanate from) or something else?
1 Like
I explain in detail how I arrive at the ground values in a previous post I did on the Peak Prosperity forum. Please look at the ‘So Its Back To First Principles’ thread, post: 1736.