Please provide a video reference.
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Are you sure? âEveryâ is a very broad categorization. My own experience is that every video recording I have been able to find has a very distinct sound and cadence for 1-3 versus 4-8.
Can you provide references to those you have listened to and made your conclusions? I am willing to be persuaded because I would rather not waste any more of my time analyzing the recordings I have found, so far.
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I agree that every audio except one makes shots 1-3 sound vastly difference in sound and cadence versus shots 4-8. Cadence can be easily explained away, but sound cannot, for a person who was apparently stationary for all 8 shots on the same location and rooftop.
The ONLY audio that makes them sound similar is from inside the police dash cam parked on the E. AGR#6. Thatâs expected since itâs a muffled recording.
Greg, this guy here recorded Shot 10 from the bleachers. Maybe it helps. Itâs the clip with 1m23s duration.
https://x.com/MikePic36487/status/1813258690427859306
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I agree with all your facts and conclusions with the exception I retain some optimism that the TDOA line of analysis can show something significant w.r.t. how many source positions are possible, i.e. there is more than one. I have been taught the relevant math (or at least a lot of it, unfortunately decades ago) and I also worked in an industry where analysis of multiple recorded waveforms at various positions was used to make billion dollar decisions.
Unfortunately, just eyeballing the data is enough to make it clear to me that computations able to discriminate down to the resolution of a few feet are nontrivial to the extent that, even if I (or anyone else) managed to âproveâ multiple source positions, its going to be an uphill battle to get anyone that does not have several semesters of college calculus, etc. to accept such a result.
Regardless, I am still staring at the waveforms, trying to review the math, and trying find a line of analysis that might persuade. It will have to persuade me first, by the way.
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There you go⌠watch it in motion on a desktop monitor in full screen to see it clearly. Watch it over and over again on a loop, and keep in mind the following: recoil is not a monstruous thing and this was recorded from 100 yards away on a shaky hand, so focus on the hair to see the recoil. The case is clearly visible.
https://x.com/Danilo8313/status/1821010254236139610
I made this clip with a phone by recording the screen of a 25" desktop monitor playing the original video at 720p, which is the max resolution available on the TMZ website since july 13th. You can actually see the guyâs hair move when the case ejects, for crying out loud. Oh, and on the original video, the case flies just before the sound of shot 1 is heard. light being faster than sound and allâŚ
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Listen to this with your eyes closed after you understand from the image what I fabricated for comparison. Tell me what you think.
Something is manipulated here making it confusing.
this is the type of shit that is exhausting. weâre trying to get to the bottom of this, and then people have to go out of their way to convince others that the gunman actually shot the gun lol
it feels like some people are forcing us to go backwards. First Crooks is the shooter, now some people donât think he even fired the first shot lol
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Well, yes, like the image shows, I cut shot 3 and pasted it 5 times over simulating the cadence of the real 5 shots and our ears hearing all on top of each other. Apart from that, nothing else, not even audio levels. Then, I placed the real 5-shot sequence afterwards, to compare the two and see if several shots #3 sound similar to the 5-shot volley. To me, they sound the same.
dude I was agreeing with youâŚwtf
oh shit, youâre right! sorry, Iâm getting so used up on getting attacked I got defensive without reading it carefully. Iâll delete it.
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While itâs very difficult to tell, and this annoying woman screaming nonstop makes it painful to watch, this video to me shows Crooks not moving during the first shot. What is frustrating is that it is one of the best pieces of evidence and if this person could have just stayed on Crooks the entire time, and kept others from walking in front, this mystery would be solved.
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/k65nwmeqj5di0pd955skd/AN08uf-LWBWkrCjj7R7zT8M?dl=0&e=2&preview=Source+3+-+TMZ+ROSS+GET+OVER+HERE+angle+ssstwitter.com_1721402598773.mp4&rlkey=sof7l8mqzawrj9k7qa848uprp&st=x37ozue0
Watch from the original release at a higher resolution. This is the clip that I recorded from playing it full screen on a monitor with my phone. I focused just on Crooks while recording the screen. Then I cropped the video from the cellphone, which actually blows up the image a bit more. It took some attempts to get it right, because of all the movement. (btw, I bet the person who recorded it can see that case very clearly without doing what I had to do⌠bet he or she is sitting there with a 1080p or higher resolution of this video).
Brian60221 ~ obviously I wonât be receiving my âJunior G Manâ badge. You were correct â at the tail end of the Grassley video the camo-guy recounted â8 shell casingsâ on the roof, not â5â. My contention now of 2 Shooters is in doubt . . . maybe. My original belief was Shooter #1 fires the 1st 3 shots, followed by Shooter #2 (Crooks) firing 5 shots, Shot #9 is questionable & of âUnknown Originâ, & lastly, the âFatal Shotâ by the Sniper taking out Crooks. This was fully supported by Chrisâ audio analysis & sound distinction between the 3 & 5 shots.
But, with the Grassley bodycam video confirming â8 shell casingsâ on the roof, that throws a monkeywrench into the audio analysis. We have to assume these shell casings were discharged from the weapon Crooks fired. Forensics will no doubt validate that premise. In addition, the sniper who took out Crooks had him in his sights for a good 3 minutes. He would be âwitnessâ to the discharge of those 8 shots. As to why he allowed as many is questionable, but it all happened in mere seconds.
Although . . . listening to the audio file that Chris posted, the distinctive difference between Shots 1 - 3 & 4 - 8 is most compelling. And all the posters tend to agree. Itâs been validated that Crooks purchased the shells that morning. This seems to be rather conflicting. Unless . . .
This entire scheme is an elaborately orchestrated assassination attempt. Crooks undoubtedly had Instruction & Assistance. The question becomes âhow muchâ was from the âinsideâ? Either the entire group of Secret Service down to the Local Law Enforcement are nothing but a bunch of âKeystone Kopsâ, or . . . they were intentionally manipulated & distracted from their jobs & posts. What we are âseeingâ vs what we are âhearingâ may very well be âslight-of-handâ.
Facts or Fantasy or Farfetched . . . ?
Crooks had a ârange finderâ, + used a drone to scout the area previously. Distraction or actual useful data?
Crooks (or someone else) brought a rifle on to the grounds â he had to have âhelpâ or he was damn lucky.
Crooks had to get on top of the roof undetected â no one knows how. More âhelpâ, more âguidanceâ?
Crooks fired 8 shots, but were they all from the rooftop? Crooks had gone to a âtarget rangeâ to practice. Suppose he picked up 3 empty shell casings (as âinstructedâ) & brought those to the rooftop, then dropped them near where he lay.
Suppose the âPlanâ was for him to let another Shooter (#1) fire the 1st 3 rounds, then Crooks, on cue, fire the next 5. That allowed just enough time for Shooter #1 to gather his shell casings, then vacate the premises. If he was one of the âSecurityâ then nobody suspects him in the area â especially if thereâs another âteam memberâ.
Suppose Shooter #1 entered the lower ground floor in the building behind Crooks where the ground floor sniper had vacated his post leaving it unmanned, as well as the unmanned 2nd sniper post on the 2nd floor leaving Crooks unchecked. The trajectory of the bullets from ground level raised enough to clip DjT, then go higher into the stands hitting the guy on the top row. This would then also validate the audio differentiation.
There have been confirmed 3 undercover SS agents dressed just like Crooks â khaki shorts & t-shirts, thus, the sniper who took out Crooks was in doubt if he was taking out an assassin or an SS agent. That would account for the delay . . . unless the sniper was part of the âteamâ.
Suppose Crooks was assured of an easy âescape planâ, being protected by his âteamâ, but unknowing there was no escape plan. Thus, the âPatsyâ sacrifice & NO evidence.
Suppose the âdetonatorâ & explosive devices were merely decoys for distraction & to create the illusion that Crooks was a genius mastermind with more criminal intent.
Suppose the FBI &/or Secret Service scrubbed all devices belonging to Crooks â his cellphone, computer, etc. No traces, nothing to track, no paper trails.
Farfetched? Something to think about . . . RnB
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I put an analysis online (link below) of different, but very similar, lines of sight coming from the buildings from which Crooks allegedly fired his rounds. The first lines of sight align very well with the lines of sight from the higher building behind him.
I made a KML-file available with which you can explore the various positions yourself.
The various points of interest have been documented at coordinate level, including (shooting) distances and heights in meters, yards and feet.
The points of interested included are: the position where the man was shot dead, Trumpâs ear and the other known victims who got injured or killed, etc.
All constructive feedback is welcome!
If someone can provide me with the speed of sound of the day of Trumpâs rally, I can easily include timings of the sonic booms at various distances.
Thanks for your feedback!
Source Material
feel free to download the current KML snapshot from https://www.howdoiknowthisinfo.com/butler/snapshots/snapshot_current.zip
hello wwrr55, this is so true, but I hope that I can give you a head start with my previous postâŚ
the distances and heights are shown in meters, centimeters, yards and feetâŚ
enjoy!
My considerations on the echoes of source 4.
First if the World was perfect the location of the echo wall would be in the ellipse where the source and the receiver are the locus of that ellipse. Because the ellipse has the propriety of been the geometric place were the sum of the distances to the locus are constant. Here is an explanation of that.
In the 1 to 3 shots the echo is around 0.08s. In the 5 to 8 is 0.17s
I manage to estimate source 4 position in both times.
Here is the ellipse for shots 1 to 3.
Here is the ellipse for shots 4 to 8.
These are not perfect conditions here because there is no line of sight from the source to the receiver or no line of sight from the source and the receiver to echo wall.Therefore, the probable location is in within the ellipse.
For me Iâm inclined to believe that is the represented blue walls in the images.
Hereâs the calculation using your ballistic calculator âŚ
Assuming 77gr OTM rounds which are designed for distance and accuracy competition shooting:
The approximate average velocity is then
(2789 + 2500)/2 = 2644 fps
Based on the three DIFFERENT snick-report times, this yields:
⢠1st shot .2205 x (1/1152 - 1/2644) = 450 ft
⢠2nd shot .215 = 439 ft
⢠3rd shot .209 = 427 ft
Only that 1st shot seems to match the distance of 454 ft reasonably well. The snick-report times on the 2nd and third shots still imply closer distances for the shooter.
CONCLUSION:
We need to know WHAT THOSE BULLETS WERE!
If they were anything LESS than 77 gr, I think itâs HIGHLY likely there was a 2nd shooter.
If they were 77 gr, then this analysis is just BARELY compatible with a single shooter at least for the 1st shot.
But we still have the obvious problem that Crooksâ shoulder did NOT move on the 1st shot!
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There are three audio channels within the patrol car video 1382_202407131806_Unit5-0.mp4, and this the car of the famous roof-climbing Butler city police officer, who parked his vehicle at the eastern side of AGR building 6 with a view to its main door. Interestingly, these three audio channels appear to record microphones mounted at front, middle and rear of the car, with the outermost two channel recording ambient noise.
Within the first coming group of three shots, the signal farrives first on channel one, then on channel two and then on channel three. The delay between channel 1 and channel 3 is around 10 ms. I havenât yet checked the second group of shots, but I expect them to show the same pattern âŚ
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