Audio Analysis Is Most Consistent Two Shooters At Trump Rally

I don’t believe one can make that direct conclusion, because almost any “hit” (and we don’t know exactly the injury) would likely throw the bullet trajectory off even a few degrees. Here’s an example from Brandon Herrera shooting a dummy Trump head/ear with a 5.56mm. This minor impact causes the bullet to yawk and start to tumble.

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A trained sniper (and I assume this theoretical person would have extensive military and police training/experience) would be unaffected by the heat from a attic over a short period of time. And at most we’re likely theorizing perhaps 445pm til 615pm, a trivial amount of time to endure some attic heat. It could have, theoretically, been as few as 10 minutes if we were to go with the theory that GN was the helper/lookout to keep others out of the building and there was another shooter climbing into and egressing from the snipers nest over a period of maybe 10 or so minutes.

2nd floor 3rd window is a possibility we cannot rule out. However I think we can conclusively eliminate all 1st floor AGR#6 windows. It has been “proven” (I think by a Congress rep) that they do not open and we know none were broken, and furthermore the lower portions have a field of fire obstructed by the fence and bleachers. These windows are a dead end.

There’s literally nowhere else on the roof next to Crooks for a 2nd shooter to “hide,” during or after the shooting. Far too many witnesses and video angles. Where could have have gone? There were 100 sets of eyeballs on that roof.

The vent is viable, the 2nd story window is viable, and the 2nd story rooftop is viable in my view. And if I were the pro, I’d have chosen the latter.

I believe I can see slight recoil on his right shoulder and his left foot. It’s nearly imperceptible but I believe I see it. I think you’re under the impression it’s going to be super obvious but the AR15 simply is so popular in part because there is almost no recoil, making it very easy to learn to shoot. Just like you’re not going to see “rifle smoke” (and you keep mis-spelling rifle), seeing recoil under these circumstances will be difficult at best.

If you watch the video @daniloraf posted a few entries above yours you will see a slow-motion video of someone firing an AR15 and the recoil on that closeup slow motion video is minuscule. It would be very hard to see on a zoomed in low quality cellular phone video from 150 yards away, such as this.

Correct, virtually no recoil and would be very hard to see on a shaky cell phone video camera from 150 yards away. Saying there’s no recoil observed is inconclusive at best.

The evidence shows that Crooks had the rifle in the normal prone firing position during the first audible shot. Whether the took that shot is up for honest debate but the rifle was clearly in the normal upright firing position so the opinion it was canted is plainly incorrect.

Having owned, fired, trained with, and deployed to war with this general rifle platform (AR15 or M4), the ejection pattern is generally strong and to the right, and can be rearward, sideways, forward, or anything in between. There are endless variables but YT videos in slow motion show these cases come out hard and often deflect on the “brass deflector” protrusion rear of the ejection port so they can go any direction to the right. I’ve never seen any go to the left of the shooter, however. On this ribbed roof they would be contained within 1 of the sets of ribs and would not roll down very far because of the tapered neck design, they’d roll only a short distance before being stopped by a rib in the roof.

As for why the shell casing count was initially 5, then 12 minutes later 8 shots, and the odd placement of those 3 other shells, it suspect. I would expect all 8 casings to be to Crooks right side, within close proximity. Apparently some where to his left which is inexplicable and almost impossible absent interference. I would like to see an actual aerial diagram of the exact location of these 8 shell casings but I doubt that will ever happen since the crime scene was quickly destroyed.

I can’t get into the mind of whoever shot at Trump and murdered and injured people. However it would be reasonable to believe the first volley was slower and well-aimed because Trump was stationary and exposed. The second faster and less accurate volley was because Trump went down and was covered by SS agents and no longer exposed so the shooter of the 2nd volley was laying down a larger number of shots to increase hit chances.

The 3rd window offers some benefits, but also problems. It could presumably be seen from those on the ground and by the other counter snipers, possibly. Another issue is trajectory, I haven’t focused on it in detail but I wonder if it is too far away from Crooks trajectory to be a viable location?

If GN “took a walk” and a pro-stepped in to do the job, that’s certainly a possibility.

The false ceiling sniper nest has some real problems, one you have pointed out. I have not scrutinized the videos but I have reviewed them and never observed any movement of any of the vent flaps to an open position - and the vents would have to be wide open. The shooter would have to be deeply recessed to avoid detection, and shooting thru open flaps would add a significant layer of difficulty. For those flaps to open fully, and close, I would think we’d have seen that on the popular video of the scene.

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I’ve been saying this for 4 weeks now, and @howdoiknowthisinfo has done great analysis on this 2nd story rooftop too.

Of all locations I think it is the most ideal because it offers a similar trajectory only 3 meters taller than Crooks position, excellent situational awareness of the law enforcement, Trump, the crowd, and Crooks getting into position. It’s easily accessible just as Crooks got onto the roof as well. I believe an assassin in a white painter type suit could have hidden up there in advance due to the facade walls on the N and E rooftops, fired his shots, and escaped. During the chaos, slip off that back wall and disappear.

Even looks like a head poking out in between these roof vents in one of the videos.


Yes, because it is perhaps the best location.

  1. Hidden from all 4 counter sniper teams. Both Hercules teams obstructed by trees, the counter sniper teams in the 2 story AGR building are facing the wrong way, and the retention pond S. team is obstructed by a building and crane arm and trees and poles and other obstacles.
  2. Best area for total situational awareness to the S and obscured from the N and E, with minimal exposure to the W. Easy access and escape paths while everyone is focused on Crooks. Just hop down and scurry away.
  3. Trajectory almost identical to Crooks, just a few meters taller.
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Tim,

I was hoping that you in particular would look at this post. I initially was with you on the far back building. But neither the snick-boom or time of arrival can be made to work–it is too far.

What I am suggesting here is the ONE-story building directly behind the Crooks building. Ingress/egress is from the window of the adjacent two-story building. If you are caught, claim you were doing LEO things and trying to apprehend Crooks. But no one can see you except maybe from the adjacent parking lot if far enough back.

This works timing-wise for the audio. Any place in front of Crooks doesn’t work, and too far back doesn’t work either.

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I agree with your assertions and think the vent location is possible, and there are good arguments to be made for the vent location including same trajectory (assuming Crooks goes to his correct instructed location, which is no guarantee), and assuming the lookout can keep the AGR#6 building clear of others.

But I find the vent location problematic for a few important reasons:

  1. No situational awareness of anything else
  2. Shooting thru open vents would be extremely difficult for a shooter recessed deep into the attic to avoid visual or sound detection
  3. We have pretty good video(s) and eye witnesses and no evidence of vents ever opening; and they’d have to be fully obviously opened.
  4. A fixed position like this would rely on either a lot of coordination or luck so that a object or people are not in the pathway - bleachers, crane, other obstacles, etc.

I think it must be seriously considered but it is not an optimal location. I think the 2 story rooftop is the best location for a professional sniper.

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Here the casing appears to fly to the shooters right at perhaps a 30-45 degree upward angle, which is consistent with an AR15 rifle ejection pattern. It would not travel directly upward nor to the shooters left. If the belief that the casing is flying directly upward, that is purely and optical illusion. The rifle is plainly held in the normal firing position with the magazine downward, as can be seen from the position of the buttstock and his cheekweld, etc.

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This theory would depend on whether those windows can be opened, but even so I think someone else running around on the lower rooftops near Crooks would have been at risk of being observed. AND SHOT.

I had considered that it’s plausible for someone else, as you’re suggesting, to have left his post inside the 2 story and gone the same path to/from the roof as Crooks with plausible deniability if seen, jumping down, returning into the building thru the NW doors and resuming his guard post.

The taller roof is practically invisible to the ground, yet offers a similar trajectory, and the shooter could escape off it, jump to the ground in the alcove, and return into AGR#2 guard post.

Perhaps that just too complicated of a plan when firing from the AGR#2 is quite simple and easy to execute.

As for the snick/boom, I’m not thoroughly convinced in the reliability of the data due to too many unknowns and variables which could theoretically account for a fraction of a second. We’re relying on cellular phone videos, compression rates, unknown distances with many variables, etc.

The only snick/boom I have confidence in, is the podium stage mic.
IIRC, it is the only source that has not spent time in Government possession.

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He could have dropped down into that little courtyard behind the second building afterwards, where Greg N could have let him back in. Maybe he cut his hand on the gutter?

There is a ton of plausible deniability as long as no one sees you actually take the shots. You can literally put your head behind Crooks’ head as viewed from the podium area but 80 feet further back. Then if someone says hey I saw you on the roof, just say yeah, I was out there to get Crooks until the SWAT/SS bullets started flying.

Snick/boom depends on bullet velocity and closest approach to the microphone, so there is a lot of slop there.

Time of arrival depends on measuring the timing of a 500 Hz-ish sine wave where you are taking a sample of it every 4 degrees, which is less than an inch, so raw timing can be extremely accurate. The only real variable is whether the microphone and sound source have a line-of-sight view of each other. Most everyone did of Crooks. For a second shooter, wherever he was, almost no one did.

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Here I am over this warehouse area where a Google camera 8 feet off the ground in the parking lot can’t see me…

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Thoughts regarding the offset sights:

A. The FBI clearly wanted to make ‘note’ of all the ‘attachments’ or ‘possible modifications’ found on the weapon, even down to the picatinny rail. How then do they leave off of their list the offset iron sights? I don’t think those are more common than the picatinny rail yet left absent. They also happen to not detail the muzzle break/flash suppressor used and photographed, which appears to be slotted on the sides and top and solid on the bottom.
Odd.

B. As far as the sound would suggest to me, 3 slower shots followed by a rapid volley of 5 would potentially indicate taking three “well-aimed” shots through an optic, and then rotating to iron sights to spray. Could this rotation to change sights explain a change in audio from certain videos, and then also even less audio discrepancy in other videos? I also imagine the rotation would affect the trajectory of the spent casings too. I don’t think I’ve seen yet; do we have a mapping of where the cases were found in relation to the body or weapon?

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Yup, several omissions including the offset iron sites, the forward grip, the muzzle device… Failed to correctly ID the optic as a Holosun and used the model designator instead. The charging handle is not in the locked forward position either. Looks like an intern unfamiliar with guns did this assembly and slide photo/description. Sloppy indeed.

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The flash suppressor looks to be a standard A2 flash suppressor. It is the most common one used on AR type rifles. There are other attachments not listed, too.

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Okay, but fish-eye optics are weird and also this wouldn’t account for the added height of a person, nor would it account for a larger angle if someone is farther back in the parking lot or approaching from a distance, like several officers were…

  • No situational awareness of anything else (That is what Nicol was for)

  • Shooting thru open vents would be extremely difficult for a shooter recessed deep into the attic to avoid visual or sound detection
    (I think 18" back would work good. And a side mount scope is needed for the approximate 2" high and 11" wide view through the vent)

  • We have pretty good video(s) and eye witnesses and no evidence of vents ever opening; and they’d have to be fully obviously opened.
    (Agreed it is a challenge with the theory, it would take the confiscating of video (they took Stewarts for 4 days) or altering of police body cam…but…if I am correct, all the video of the vents during the shooting have been under the custody of the state at one point or another)

  • A fixed position like this would rely on either a lot of coordination or luck so that a object or people are not in the pathway - bleachers, crane, other obstacles, etc. (not really sure that is a problem since Trump is so high and the vent location is so high)

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Actually, the weakness link in the vent theory is how a pro missed the kill shot.

I don’t quite understand why people continue to repeat this incorrect statement. It wasn’t that the assassin missed, as much as Trump simply moved at the last millisecond that saved his life.

The assassin had Trump perfectly aligned in his sights/optic for a lethal bullseye head shot to the temple from his right profile. Trump turned and faced the assassin, presenting a narrower view and shifting his position so his ear was winged. Had Trump not moved, he’d have been dead from an instant kill shot. That is a “hit” under all normal circumstances, and was still a “hit” but only a grazing wound.

Trump moved a millisecond in time, probably at the exact moment the assassin pulled the trigger.

It’s possible. But Nicols wouldn’t really have good visual on Crooks being in position (that is a key requirement to lend credibility to the 1 shooter theory). Sure he can be heard theoretically crawling on the roof but the assassin would need to know he’s in position with his rifle. The vent location assassin could not know Crooks was delayed or interfered with by a cop climbing up for a look, for instance. Or any other events happening on the roof or to the S, W, E, or rooftop of the AGR. If Crooks was for instance detained, or shot and killed, this position would not know.

I don’t know what you’re trying to articulate, but if you have some blinds at home, try to replicate holding a rifle and aiming thru the blinds at a target from several feet back. It would be extremely difficult, adding a huge layer of complexity to shoot thru a vent at a target. You’d be lining up to variables that would be really really difficult.

The lack of any witness or video identifying the vents were open is really problematic.

One further point that could kill the theory is information the interior layout and those vents, which might totally rule it out. Time will tell.

Well, he missed his next two shots when Trump’s head was still.

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If Semper Fi was standing to the left of Ross, he could not have moved from right to left in the TMZ video.

Someone else could have been filming behind the tree. Since Malis/Piper Grimley pans the camera towards Crooks as he goes behind the tree, it is not possible to see in his video whether anyone was standing there.

In addition, Ross’ face is not too clearly recognizable. You can only see a beard.

It would be best to ask him if he was wearing a cowboy hat there that day.

Maybe someone from here knows how to reach him.

Serious question, not meant as insulting. Have you ever fired a gun, especially a rifle at a long range target?

There’s recoil, which makes subsequent shots more difficult to be as accurate when fired in rapid succession.

I’d take a educated guess to say the shooter expected the 1st shot to be all that was needed, surprised he missed, fired 2 more as accurate and fast as possible. These would not have been as well aimed. His 1st shot was the best aimed.

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